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Jeepman, I agree with Carbuff. The problem is that the bar 'stick-slips' in the bushing. You either fix the bar to the bushing, or just let the bar twist in the bushing. Either way, I can't see much difference, as the effort to twist a steel bar is much, much greater than to twist a rubber bushing.

In conclusion, submarines have kept Canadians safe from the 'Red Menace' for many, many years, and trapping a round bar in a round bushing is almost impossible.
 

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Note, the above post was written for both Levy and Jeepman, both of whom were protected by our quiet submarines!
Must have been diesel-electric running on battery power and electric motors. How did you keep quiet on the submarines though? :)
 
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trapping a round bar in a round bushing is almost impossible.
Tell that to my Jeep with its sway bar bushings proudly displayed on the front bumper. :)
 

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Jeepman, I can't put anything past you, and, yes, diesel electrics running on batteries are very quiet. And very dangerous to our nuclear submarines, despite my efforts to keep them quiet!
 

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Discussion Starter #25
I've attached a Moog "problem solver" writeup that provides two Moog part numbers for sway bar bushings, one part number without nylon insert and one part number with. I believe this is a 2012 document.

I've also attached a Moog "problem solver" writeup on the swaybar links... as well as the older Moog bushing. I believe this is a 2007 document.

I currently have the Moog K7258 links and the Moog K200601 bushings with nylon inserts on my 2005.

The bushings seem to have held up fairly well with over 100,000 miles on them and still no noise.

The links, on the other hand, had to be replaced at about 90,000 miles... and I was absolutely on top of the lubrication on the links every time I rotated tires, serviced brakes, or had the front wheels off for any reason.

One thing I discovered about the Moog links is that there are at least two significantly different link designs out there with one of those two providing better grease seals than the other; however, they are marked as the same part numbers. Another big difference is that one of these designs comes with the zerks pre-installed and ball joints pre-lubed while the other design comes with zerks you have to install yourself prior to lubricating the ball-joints yourself.

So, one question I have is whether your moog links got properly lubricated at install and whether they've been serviced with fresh lube on a regular basis? Failure to lubricate up the set that comes unlubricated would put a quick end to a set of these...

Another clunk source I've seen is the strut rod center nut working loose inside the upper strut mount. This seems to be a common problem with "quick struts..."
Thats for all this. Interesting how Moog has three different options. K200601looks the best wit the hard insert. Did you use your origional mopar bushing brackets? They are $37 each at the dealer(!)
 

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You're the one in your pyjamas. 😁
That's a big vessel, I mean boat.
 

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Just an example of your Canadian loonies at work.

Also, I understand Trump has a plan to build a wall across the Canadian-US border, which will be paid for in loonies.
 

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I'm also thinking that the noise could be the bushing itself 'stick - slipping' in the bracket. That being said, thinking has always gotten me into a lot of trouble, especially when I think about women!
 

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Yes, I used the original brackets and bolts... IIRC, it was a little difficult to push the brackets down far enough to get the bolts started, but it was doable.
The first installation of the Mopar insert bushing caused me a problem like that, couldn't get the nut on. Didn't happen later on. Either I lined it up better or the bracket bent some (which could explain something).
 

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The first installation of the Mopar insert bushing caused me a problem like that, couldn't get the nut on. Didn't happen later on. Either I lined it up better or the bracket bent some (which could explain something).
I think the issue is the "hinging" motion of the factory bracket design. That hinging motion requires the bracket to "slide" across the bushing surface (and, possibly, the bushing to slide just a bit on the frame) as you attempt to close the bolt-end of the bracket. I think that friction with the bushing not wanting to slide creates the majority of the problem. In hindsight, perhaps if I'd used an appropriate lubricant on all outer surfaces of the bushing to reduce sliding friction while closing bracket then things would have gone easier. What can I say... we live and learn, hopefully getting smarter along the way!

Also, IIRC, the driver side was more difficult because of where the bolt was placed with respect to other structural members... seems like you had to be a bit more of a contortionist on the driver side to both push the bracket down while getting the bolt & nut started on the threads.

In all honesty, it wasn't that hard to just press the bracket down... it was the combination of pressing the bracket down while simultaneously trying to work the bolt and nut. IIRC, the passenger side went easily enough but the driver side made me curse once or twice! Of course, having nicer facilities/equipment probably helps... I was outside in the driveway, laying under the van with my back on concrete and the front of the van up on ramps...
 

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A slightly longer bolt might make installation easier.
Some mentioned going that route. It was only a problem with the insert bushing, I guess because of the extra thickness..
 

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I also went through two sets of bushings, the second and current set being Moog. I have Moog grease-able end links as well. One thing I have noticed doing suspension work, once you replace a worn part, it now becomes the strongest fit and seems to exacerbate the wear/noise of another part. Over the course of two years, I wound up replacing both control arm assemblies with greaseable ball joints, outer tie-rod ends, and both struts. Basically the entire front suspension. Noises are gone. Grease at oil changes. Alignment actually adjustable within spec now. 2006 T&C 184K miles.
 

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Good advice on orienting the split. I installed MOOGs a few years ago and haven't had any problems. I'd like to add that if anybody is considering lubricating the rubber to use silicone grease as it does not depreciate the rubber.
 

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Discussion Starter #38
Update- last November installed the latest Moog K200601 bushings which are the black rubber with clear/white nylon center inserts. The "pretty blue" ones failed years ago and those are obsolete but still being sold vs "called back".

Instantly quiet again. That was the source of the creaking that changed to clunking last fall.

My Moog links have zerks and are greased.

I live in the snowy great lakes area, with salt. After the deep freeze it unusually warmed up and the roads dried in early March....and the iritating creaking returned with no clucking (yet) (about 4,000 miles on those updated moog bushings. Sounds like the Santa Maria in the Bermuda Triangle. Even creaks on those anoying parking lot speed jumps.

I thought this couldn't be!! I called Moog........"dont lube them!"....................ya right.....

So I sprayed some silicone spray at the bushings anyway. Much less creaking till the silicone evaporates. So this proves the noise is the bushing area again.

The bar was not intentionally "ruffed up" at the bushing area before installation.........makes sense to do that though. These bushings need to be stuck on the bar or rotate somewhat freely.......none of this inbetween BS that results in creaks.

I have some ""fluid Film" spray lube that says its lanolen based and rubber friendly. That should last longer than the silicone spray of only a few days.

Next time I'm going with OEM cry$ler bushing$, a new bar and new clamp$. This is ridiculous with 145K on the van. Noisy vehicles sound and feel like a junk heap. What a joke of an engineering design.

Despite driving in the snowy salty north, the underside is still silver vs rusty.
 

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My van is creaking too. Guess I know why now. I put the Moog (I think) blue sway bar bushings on it about 8k ago. Everything else seemed fine when I checked it last. I probably won't bother to do anything about it because it isn't a safety issue, but it is still annoying.
 

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Getting the OE bond, bushing to sway bar, isn't likely to happen without a new sway bar, I'm thinking. I wonder if the articulation of the links doesn't play a role as well. There's obviously too much movement of the bar (rotational, maybe even lateral) for the system to handle over time.
Anyway, when they start squeaking, there's loss of grip happening, hence wear starting. Applications of Fluid Film can quiet it down for quite awhile. The system isn't as efficient at dampening motion anymore but at least it's quiet.
I have roughed the bar up in the past with little success. Too bad one couldn't bond the bushing to the bar in a neutral position.
 
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