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Discussion Starter #61
That's the term they used in the newsletter I linked above, it would be what the dealer stocks to service vehicles and to sell.
I wonder if I would be safe to go with this product and just pull the lower rad hose and refill. I'd do it twice.

Peak North American Vehicle
 

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I'd really like to just pull the lower rad hose and refill with the appropriate 50/50 mix and maybe do that twice, but I'm freaked out now, not knowing what's in there.

What about something like this? Since OAT and HOAT can interact with each other, how can a coolant be "Universal formula is compatible with any color or type of antifreeze/coolant"?

Peak 50/50

Thanks again. I appreciate the help.
Confusing, isn't it. I think it's intended to be so.

I believe any universal antifreeze is OAT, across the board.

HOAT is a hybrid OAT

Original Green is an IAT, which is quite different.

As for compatibility, Valvoline Zerex G-05 HOAT is "compatible with many brands of coolant commonly available" per:
Didn't see that coming, did you? :)

Mopar is stating a 10 year life for their OAT (Mopar 10 Year/150,000 Mile Coolant) whereas others state less, more likely 5 years. Go figure.

Valvoline has a couple that meet the Chrysler Spec. MS-12106, except for the 10 year life:
VALVOLINE™ ZEREX™ AMERICAN VEHICLE ANTIFREEZE / COOLANT
VALVOLINE™ ZEREX™ DEX-COOL ANTIFREEZE / COOLANT

As for the lifetime antifreeze (PEAK), I don't know that I would go there. PEAK North American Vehicle coolant should work fine per:.
Chrysler: 2013 and newer
 
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Discussion Starter #64
I knew you would weigh in, Jeepman. I appreciate that. I'll read the links that you provided on my breaks at work.. Hopefully, it will calm my fears. I'm still not sure how to proceed. How does one know what has been put into the system? I saw pics of what can happen if HOAT and OAT are mixed - frightening! Is there a way to test coolant for type? I wonder if the dealership could do that. It's more than likely the factory fill in there but no real way of being 100% sure. Would a pic of the coolant help decide what kind it is? Thanks!
 

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I would change it out using 3 drains and refills, over time intervals to allow total mixing. and then do a drain and refill every 2.5 years after that.

Based on 50% dump each time, 3 drains/refills would leave about 6% of old fluid in the system. 6% of 10 liters = 0.6 liters old antifreeze left. Two dumps would leave about 12.5%

If it's the OE fluid (most likely is), then it's getting near time for a change anyway.
 
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Discussion Starter #67
Zerex G30 is an OAT aftermarket coolant that meets FCA (MS-12106) specs for your 2013.


As far as flushing it, you showed a picture of a new heater core y-pipe. I little air pressure (Low - stay under 20 psi) and you could empty the the front and rear heater cores.
Excellent suggestion on purging the heater cores. Shouldn't be a problem as I have a compressor and can rig up any number of adapters/fittings.

My problem still remains. I need to know how to determine what's currently in there for coolant. If I can't conclusively figure that out, I'm going to have to do several flushes with distilled water, as much as I don't want to do that.

Thanks much!
 

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Discussion Starter #68 (Edited)
I would change it out using 3 drains and refills, over time intervals to allow total mixing. and then do a drain and refill every 2.5 years after that.

Based on 50% dump each time, 3 drains/refills would leave about 6% of old fluid in the system. 6% of 10 liters = 0.6 liters old antifreeze left. Two dumps would leave about 12.5%

If it's the OE fluid (most likely is), then it's getting near time for a change anyway.
When you recommend 3 drains and refills, do you mean with a 50/50 mix of antifreeze, or with distilled water, then a 50/50 mix? I am hoping that it is the factory OAT fill, but don't know how I will figure that out. Maybe I will take a pic of the fluid in daylight and that might help. So, looking at your other post, you would recommend Valvoline Zerex American or the Peak American? This assumes that the van currently has OAT in it. I guess I'm worried as I'm on the edge of when Chrysler switched from HOAT to OAT (2013).
 

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Discussion Starter #69 (Edited)
Brake parts arrived. Not bad at under $300.00 for 4 coated rotors, 2 ceramic pad sets, slider clips, taxes included and free shipping. I nearly threw my back out moving the boxes inside. These rotors are HUGE!!! You don't get that sense when they are on the van. I'm used to Yaris sized rotors as I've done the most brake jobs on those. Wish I had a new Yaris rotor on my shelf (just did a complete brake job on my turbo Yaris) to put on top of the T&C rotor just for a laugh.

Nice coating on these rotors, all new clips and the front pads are also massive. For purposes of scale, you can see my pup's paw in the lower right corner. He is a pretty big dog.

Some info on the rotor coating:

Rotor Coating

Not sure how long these will actually keep the rust at bay. But, better than uncoated, I suppose. It looks a lot like the VHT ceramic paint I put on my rotor hats and outer edges, which does last a while. Maybe their application will be longer lasting.

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Some closeups...

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Nice stainless steel shims.

59946
 

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Discussion Starter #70

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When you recommend 3 drains and refills, do you mean with a 50/50 mix of antifreeze, or with distilled water, then a 50/50 mix? I am hoping that it is the factory OAT fill, but don't know how I will figure that out. Maybe I will take a pic of the fluid in daylight and that might help. So, looking at your other post, you would recommend Valvoline Zerex American or the Peak American? This assumes that the van currently has OAT in it. I guess I'm worried as I'm on the edge of when Chrysler switched from HOAT to OAT (2013).
Use demineralized or distilled water for the refills, then use concentrated antifreeze for the last refill.

Any brand name that meets the spec should work. Might check for one with the longest life.

What's your Owner Manual say for coolant type?
 

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Discussion Starter #72
Use demineralized or distilled water for the refills, then use concentrated antifreeze for the last refill.

Any brand name that meets the spec should work. Might check for one with the longest life.

What's your Owner Manual say for coolant type?
Thanks! Van calls for OAT. I called the Dodge dealer and they confirmed - by VIN - that the factory fill was OAT. It's the right color too. I also talked to a radiator shop as the dealer would only do a rad hose pull and refill. The radiator shop does power flushes, would use Valvoline MaxLife Antifreeze and charge me $139.00. This would get all the fluid out including the heater cores, block etc. I'm leaning toward this service, vs, 2 - 3 distilled drain and fills, then refill with 50/50. The rad shop also said that no matter what anyone claims, 2 years should be used as a service interval regardless of the product used. Have to make my mind up soon, though I have the trans/filter and rear brake jobs to do.

As an aside, my floor liners arrived today. Just received the delivery notification and can't wait to get home and install them. Heat gun for shaping is standing by! I bought these:

Maxliner
 

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When I did the drain and refills I would drain, fill with demineralized water, run until thermostat opens up, run 5 minutes or so more for mixing to occur, shut down, wait a bit for cooling, drain again, refill with demineralized water, run until thermostat opens up, run for 5 minutes or so more, shut down, wait a bit for cooling down, drain again, fill with concentrate, run, while topping up initially once thermostat opens up, let cool, top up.

You can do all that while doing your brake job. :)

Most premixed coolant has demineralized water in the mix. Sobeys or Irving has 18.9L prefilled jugs of that stuff. Make sure it isn't regular spring water. $10.00 for the jugs, which can be returned for $10.00 refund, plus say $6.00 per jug for the water. Get two jugs, have a drink while doing the job. :)

Your top hose will tell you when the thermostat is open, so will your EVIC and temperature gauge.

The loops to your rear heat are always open, don't worry about them.

PS: Anyone that says to change coolant every two years is upselling you. That's not Valvoline talking. Two year changes went out with the older versions of the Original Green IAT antifreeze, Even that has been updated to longer intervals (Valvoline Zerex OG - 5 years/100,000 miles). Go elsewhere and you will be glad you did as to knowing what was actually done with your system.

For the record, my 2002 GC Sport had coolant changes as I described above. It even had the Original Green in it for a couple of years, a lot of the HOAT systems did and survived handsomely. It still had the original radiator, water pump, heater cores and some of the heater hoses on it at 15 years/370,000 km, with no leaks. Pretty hard to beat that. :)
 

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Discussion Starter #74
When I did the drain and refills I would drain, fill with demineralized water, run until thermostat opens up, run 5 minutes or so more for mixing to occur, shut down, wait a bit for cooling, drain again, refill with demineralized water, run until thermostat opens up, run for 5 minutes or so more, shut down, wait a bit for cooling down, drain again, fill with concentrate, run, while topping up initially once thermostat opens up, let cool, top up.

You can do all that while doing your brake job. :)

Most premixed coolant has demineralized water in the mix. Sobeys or Irving has 18.9L prefilled jugs of that stuff. Make sure it isn't regular spring water. $10.00 for the jugs, which can be returned for $10.00 refund, plus say $6.00 per jug for the water. Get two jugs, have a drink while doing the job. :)

Your top hose will tell you when the thermostat is open, so will your EVIC and temperature gauge.

The loops to your rear heat are always open, don't worry about them.

PS: Anyone that says to change coolant every two years is upselling you. That's not Valvoline talking. Two year changes went out with the older versions of the Original Green IAT antifreeze, Even that has been updated to longer intervals (Valvoline Zerex OG - 5 years/100,000 miles). Go elsewhere and you will be glad you did as to knowing what was actually done with your system.

For the record, my 2002 GC Sport had coolant changes as I described above. It even had the Original Green in it for a couple of years, a lot of the HOAT systems did and survived handsomely. It still had the original radiator, water pump and some of the heater hoses on it at 15 years/370,000 km, with no leaks. Pretty hard to beat that. :)
Yes. That sounds like the process I used for many of my vehicles. I can definitely manage 2 cycles of distilled water. And, I can do it while doing the rear brakes. I'm going to take the van into the school shop on Saturday. It will be gobs easier using the hoist. Quick question for you... In your third step you add the concentrate. Do you just add 1/2 system volume and top up right away with distilled before doing the final warmup/thermostat opening? Also, do you remove your reservoir and clean that as well?

I too thought that antifreeze was good for longer than 2 years. The odd thing is is that I didn't get the impression that the rad shop was trying to upsell me as he said that I could easily do this job. He said that if I could determine what was in there, I could just do a drain and refill or two. He said something else though that slightly raised an eyebrow. He claimed to have strips that could tell me which type of coolant was in there. I know about the strips, but didn't think they could identify the type of coolant, just such things as acidity, remaining reserve etc.

Thanks very much for the lead on the large jugs of demineralized water. I hadn't thought of that. I was prepared to buy several 4L jugs of distilled.
 

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Discussion Starter #75
Floor liners installed.

Overall, I'm pretty impressed. The front ones fit perfectly. The rear ones could be about 3/4" wider on each side and have a molded threshold as opposed to a cup style edge. They will work well though. I used my heat gun and molded them nicely to fit.

59951


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59954
 

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You're having fun! :)

Your Post above (#74)
When you do your 3rd drain, you have about a liter of actual antifreeze left in the system. You have to add straight concentrate to bring the ratio to 50/50. Don't add water until you have to. Leave the reservoir for your final estimated mixture based on hydrometer results. Based on 50% drains, your %s are 25%, 12.5% and 6.25%. I haven't worked on a 3.6L.
If you use the draincock with the radiator cap closed, the reservoir will self drain, otherwise use a $5.00 squeeze bulb siphon pump to evacuate it.
 
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Discussion Starter #77
You're having fun! :)

Your Post above (#74)
When you do your 3rd drain, you have about a liter of actual antifreeze left in the system. You have to add straight concentrate to bring the ratio to 50/50. Don't add water until you have to. Leave the reservoir for your final estimated mixture based on hydrometer results. Based on 50% drains, your %s are 25%, 12.5% and 6.25%. I haven't worked on a 3.6L.
If you use the draincock with the radiator cap closed, the reservoir will self drain, otherwise use a $5.00 squeeze bulb siphon pump to evacuate it.
Thanks. I'm going to post my process and products below. Apparently, the 3.6 has a bleeder bolt on the block to release air. I think I saw this on a video recently, but will have to do some additional research.
 

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Discussion Starter #78
So, after lengthy discussions with a Dodge dealer service department manager, a radiator repair shop and my local Carquest parts guy (who is very experienced, and whom I trust), I've decided to go with the following coolant. It's an OAT universal coolant and among other "specifications" includes Chrysler MS7170 (which is apparently a 3-year fluid), though the packaging says, "Up to 5 years, 250000kms". Initially, the Dodge dealership suggested I do not touch the coolant as it should have lots of life in it, but after I told him that I planned to do 3 fills and flushes, he said the coolant I selected was perfectly fine. It was simply cheaper (I get a school discount) and easier (I'd have to drive an hour to buy another product) to buy this stuff locally.

Below is the product, though I bought it in the concentrated variety. I picked up 2 jugs - about 7.6L and according to the snippet from my manual, I should require about 7.7L of concentrate and the same in distilled water. I'm picking up 12 4L jugs of distilled or demineralized water. Or, if they have the big 18.5L jugs, I'll pick up three of those.

1) I'll initially drain the system - as per Jeepman's suggestion of leaving the rad cap on to drain the overflow bottle.

2) refill the system with distilled water, run the van until the thermostat opens +5 minutes or so.

3) drain the system

4) refill the system with distilled water, run the van until the thermostat opens +5 minutes or so.

5) drain the system

6) dump in the 2 jugs of concentrated antifreeze

7) top up with distilled water

8) test with hygrometer

9) adjust

59973



Global Long LIfe

59974
 

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Discussion Starter #79
Other jobs tomorrow:

I have the school shop for the day, so I plan to do the coolant change, trans service (pan drop, filter replacement, install new pan with drain plug, refill with ATF+4), read brakes and rotors. Optimistic? Maybe. Hopefully all goes well. I'd hate to end up having to leave the van on the hoist!
 

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Discussion Starter #80
You van came stock with P225 65R17 tires rated at 1764 lbs. Why would you want to put a smaller, under rated tire on it? Your speedo will be off and tires will not meet your loaded handling requirements that FCA designed it for.
I have come to agree with you, now. Not because I am worried about the tires ability to handle the weight, but due to somewhat sloppy handling associated with the lower sidewall. I took the van to a tire shop, and spoke on the phone with another shop. Both entities we quite emphatic that the tires were up to the task. I took one of the other teacher's Grand Caravans for a quick drive after I pumped their tires up to 36 cold psi. The handling was much more crisp and not 'wallowy' like mine with the current tires. So, I should have listened to you in the first place. I am ordering a set of 225/56R17s 102LI. I can probably get my $200.00 back on the tires and I'll install and balance the new ones in the shop.
 
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